Read Ch. 6 in On Reading… Blog about 3-5 things Goodman talks about that can help you be a better teacher! Blog by Friday, Nov. 14th and respond to 4 classmates by Sunday midnight Nov. 16th.
I was actually kind of confused by this chapter because it was talking about a lot of terms that I didn't know, but there was a lot of interesting information about language. One thing I thought was interesting was that understanding language depends on so many factors, not just the fact that you are able to read it or hear it. I think this is important to remember when teaching kids because they can all be at such different levels. Another thing I found interesting was the stress in the chapter on ambiguity of language. Since almost everything in the English language is open to more than one interpretation, it's amazing that kids are even able to learn it. He gave examples of how people make sense of text as well: by using schemas, perceiving things differently in different contexts, and using alternate information sources or going on minimal information. I think it's important to know how we work through text so you know what the kids might be going through when trying to understand it. The See Spot Run example was pretty cool because almost everyone has read that. It surprised me to be told that it has grammar problems that are confusing to kids. Once he explained it though, it totally made sense how it would be confusing. I also thought the list of words that are the most common in stories was cool to see. I think that list could be used as a vocabulary list to make sure kids know before reading. That way they would at least be prepared with knowledge of the most common words and then be able to move on to the more difficult vocabulary or use their knowledge of these words to help as context clues.
I agree with you that this chapter was a bit confusing. There was so much going on and so many aspects of language that I had not even considered. I think so much of the information can be useful to the classroom though. It really broke down the language and patterns within the language. I agree that it was so interesting to learn all of the factors for learning language. I don't remember learn the ambiguity, structure or schemas, but I think the examples in the book (like the See Spot Run example) are very helpful when thinking of what the students are struggling with. I love the idea of a vocabulary list. Have you thought about utilizing a word wall too?
I really like your idea to make a vocab list of words that commonly appear in stories. The only problem I foresee is children having a hard time understanding words like "and" "the" "it"... words that don't necessarily have a meaning. I think this is when the concept of a word wall comes into play for words that are primarily learned as sight words. I also thought it was really neat that Goodman pointed out the Ambiguity of the English language. I had never considered this before, and all of the examples he gave were very helpful.
I agree with all of you guys, I had a really hard time with this chapter. I didn't think it flowed from one aspect of language to the other. I also agree that the See Spot Run was a intereseting example because I never noticed any of that.
To everyone: I agree the chapter was a difficult read because it was confusing. I think a word wall would have helped me or even a vocabulary list because I had to take so much time out of reading this chapter to look up words.
The stress on ambiguity in this chapter is huge! It's not something that as a native English speaker I even realize.The See Spot Run example did show a lot of why there are problems with texts made in that manner.
Yes, I agree with you all about how this chapter was so difficult to understand. Especially, English is my second language, which it takes me sometimes to read. But I think I could use some of the information in this chapter in my future class.
You have some very valid points! I agree that English can be very difficult to learn. It is easier for native born Americans! Imagine how much difficult it is to learn English when it is your second language. How would you address a child in your class who is just learning English and is having a hard time understanding the main points of this chapter?
There was so much in this chapter! Wow! Starting with the first subsection of written text words systems of language function at different levels within texts. I found it fascinating to identify the similarities and differences between the different types of signs. I think it would be a lot of fun in the classroom to identify the similarities and differences between text in the language. I also found the section on syntactic cue systems to be very informative. There are so many language patterns in English. It can be overwhelming to students and even me to remember them all. I think the pattern ambiguity section shows another great activity in the classroom for the students. The students being able to see and speak the patterns in the classroom. The ambiguity lies within the many words that sound similar but have different spellings and meanings. Overall, I think the general discussion on patterns within the language would help me teach the language to my students to help them grow as a reader. If they are able to identify the patterns, they can easily decipher the similarities and differences in language, syntactic cue systems, pattern ambiguity, and the general patterns within languages. I think that this chapter has so much in it and can really help teachers teach language. It can really help students learn to read and understand the meanings of the readings.
This chapter was very..busy to say the least but interesting in some aspects too. I wonder how hard it is for ELL's to catch on to those language patterns in the english language..
Shannon, I agree that the best term to use for the chapter is busy. I found it interesting overall but it was just to long and I lost interest early on. I wish there was more charts, etc in the chapter to aid me in words I had no prior knowledge on. To both Meredith and Shannon: If you could ask one question to Goodman about this chapter what would it be and why?
I feel like this chapter is hard for me to understand but I am glad that you said it can really help students learn to read and understand the meanings of the readings.
Overall I really liked this chapter so to blog about will not be hard. So in order to keep my post semi short I will write down the five this I liked about the chapter and why I liked it (in no particular order).
Number one:the Language Levels and Cue Systems in Oral and Written Language Box found on pg. 65 Reason I liked it: I was unfamiliar with the different language levels in this book and once I started re-reading the chapter this box helped me remember the difference between the levels and cue systems that go with each. I also liked how on pg 66, Goodman asserts the fact that the reason why Phonics is in parentheses is because it is not part of the language level it is a correspondence. I always thought that phonics was a level of language but I guess I was wrong.
Number two: I liked how Goodman used the term familiolect to basically describe a family's way of communication Reason I like it: The word is fun to pronounce and spell
Number three: Schwa ambiguity and its findings. I never heard of schwa ambiguity before so I liked how Goodman described it as a problematic situation for writers than with readers. This problem occurs more with writers because it is hard to predict which vowel will appear, etc. What I liked: I referred to some findings above. The findings that Goodman mentions is on pg 71. I completely agree with his findings as well because it stresses that the higher the grade the more the class as a whole (except for some students) will show higher results no matter the experiment.
Number four: On pg 74 Goodman mentions six ways we make sense of texts. I agree with all of them. Which one do I do more when I read/write: use minimal information to get to meaning. I think I do this more often because I hate when people don't define a word write away.
Number five: See Spot Run! Reason I like it: I loved reading that book because of the imagery.
While I can come up with five things I liked I felt like this chapter was to long. I lost interest in it once I got to the section "Meaning and pragmatics level". After reading the first paragraph I had a feeling I would learn no new stuff for the rest of the chapter because I already knew that the meaning is in the writer and reader (pg. 85), and well I did.
First of all, I love how you organized your blog response! I wish I had set the format of my response like yours! It is very straight forward and I can see each individual point that can help you become a better teacher very clearly. I agree that Goodman had some really good information in this chapter! It was overwhelming actually how much information was in such a small chapter. I too found myself rereading multiple chapter boxes in order to get a clear understanding of his points. He used some great examples like the See Spot Run you wrote about. The explanations of communication, language, and imagery can all help the teachers and the students. I think his examples are very easy to apply to a classroom because that is how he wrote the chapter. He truly helped me envision myself teaching using his examples and explanations throughout the chapter.
I don't think I have ever read the book "See Spot Run!", so I actually had a hard time trying to picture the book in my mind. This brings up one of the points Goodman made about the importance of Schema. I think Goodman did an excellent job at describing the way language words in a simple way.
I also lost interest in this chapter pretty quickly, I actually found the Meanings section the most interesting. Again, Goodman gave fabulous examples of See Spot Run.
This was a long chapter! Very overwhelming. I loved See Spot Run as a kid! However, I do have to disagree with you about the word familiolect. It's pretty hard to spell for a word I don't know!
I did like the way you comment on this chapter and it shows that you got the messages of this chapter. But it's quit hard for me and I did try to read and understand this chapter.
Your blog post actually helped me to learn things that I may have missed. I liked reading your the most because of the spacing and the organization of your points. Good points and way to not get discouraged when something difficult was thrown at you. Also great way of breaking everything down.
Like my classmates, I loved See Spot Run. It's interesting how kids used the word 'father' as the subject of the sentence and created a miscue that read "Father sees Spot run." I also got to use my background knowledge about the story of "The Man Who Kept House." I read this story already for another one of Dr. Bum's classes! Lastly, I think it's important for parents to realize that babies use their families voices to invent their own sound system. How cool is that?
I love all of your examples from the book! I think you were looking towards application in the classroom while reading this chapter which is awesome! I have not hear "The Man Who Kept House." How would you use it in a classroom? What is the nook about?
I've read See Spot Run but I don't think I've ever read The Man Who Kept House. It sounds familiar.... It's funny looking back now at See Spot Run and catching how the words are used.
I agree with Meredith, how would you use "The Man Who Kept House" in a classroom and what is it about? Also how would you use "See Spot Run" in a classroom?
I thought the fact about babies using parent voices was really interesting as well! It just made me think about the fact that we should always read to kids no matter their age because even if they don't understand what you are saying it might be helping them develop their language system.
I agree with Krista and found that this chapter had lots of vocabulary that I wasn't familiar with. I thought Goodman brought up a great point in talking about Morphophonemic ambigution, the concept that teaching only phonics does not help children because we have so many different ways we use phonics and the rules do not always remain true. So, teaching kids that a certain rule always applies is not effective because they get all sorts of confused when they come across words they do not know. I also thought it was an interesting point that when students read, they learn to read and say the words automatically in their own dialect. This is a huge concept. Missouri isn't quite as southern as other states, but you still come across children in schools saying words with a twang, and it can completely change how they see and pronounce words. I think this also brings up the issue that Dr. Bum sometimes talks about with teaching African American children who speak in Eubonics. Another point I found very interesting was that students learn grammar from imitation. Students learn how to properly construct sentences through the grammar they hear everyday, so it becomes especially important for children to hear correct grammar.
I definitely agree with both you and Krista! There was so much I had never hear of before while reading this chapter. It brought up so many great points. Every student is so different when and while they are learning. I found that Goodman really did think about everything and everyone while writing this chapter. How would you ensure that every student hears correct grammar, for example, every day?
I also agree. It's so important for us to be able to speak proper grammar to these kids. I know I say gonna all the time! It's also good to think about words we may mispronounce as well.
I have never lived farther south than Arkansas but occasionally I will put an unintentional twang on words.Do you think that teaching grammar through reading books would be more effective?
I agree with your comment and I think it's hard for to understand all of the words in this chapter. It look me sometimes to understand some information. But anyways, I am glad to learn something new.
When I first read this chapter, I felt like I was in third grade again because there were some really big, confusing words. So needless to say it took me awhile to get through this chapter. What I liked was the first couple paragraphs in the chapter when Goodman compared a written word to a "living entity." We use words to represent so many things like our beliefs or our ideas. Which I think is important in, not just school, but in society. I thought the chart on page 80 was interesting and it makes sense when Goodman says "many words and phrases are used to describe the movement of the main character..." I thought that was interesting because thinking about it, you can't write a sentence without using one of those words. Lastly, I liked the "meanings" Goodman talks about, (experimental, interpersonal, textual and simultaneous). When we think of meanings, its often comprehension. I had a reading comprehension problem when i was in middle school. So I could read the words fluently but I couldn't tell you what the main idea was or what the previous sentence was about. So I think these "meaning" are like making connections.
I liked the first couple paragraphs, too! It's amazing how many words we use to express ourselves every day! Imagine all the words we can teach our kiddos!
This chapter was kind of overwhelming with so much important information and phrasing that I was unfamiliar with. Comprehension and meaning do go together well. Do you think your comprehension struggles will help you teach readers?
I like that you were able to connect your own experiences with the ideas that Goodman was talking about. I think describing words as a living entity is great. It helps show the effect word usage has on the meaning of something, and also how frequently they are adapted and change.
I felt the exact same way! You are not alone! It was hard for me to keep up since there were so many words I have not learned or have forgotten, so I did get discouraged easily. I couldn't skim this chapter like I could the other ones. I had to take it slow and read a lot more to really understand what was being taught.
I agree the chapter had a lot of words I was unfamiliar with and had to look up. Also I feel that the meanings are like making connections, like the phrase "what is the meaning of..." can be answered when making a connection.
This chapter had so much information! It was really hard to follow. I'm just going to list some of the things that stood out to me, as well as why they stood out. 1. I thought the part where Goodman was talking about letter and sound ambiguity was incredibly interesting. His mentioning of “familiolect” is incredibly accurate in my own family my Grandma on my Mom’s side was called Baba by all of the grandkids because the oldest couldn’t say grandma. As he got older we continued to call her Baba because that was our word for her.
2. Standardized spelling- this section was also really interesting. When looking at the way kids write it is easy to see how the words get confused. The explanation for how standardized spelling developed (printing press) was also interesting.
3. Last year I worked in a Kindergarten classroom and witnessed a lot of use of the sight word books and Goodman- brought up the fact that these vocabulary focused texts could help lead students to more improperly use grammar. Goodman brings up the fact that readers use a combination of grammar and wording to make sense of a text; making me question the validity of using these books in a classroom.
4. Goodman also brings up that readers and listeners are good at making sense of a text. “As long as we find the text comprehensible we select from the available cues to make predictions and inferences (84).” Because of how ambiguous language is we learn to make predictions even if words aren't used in the manner we expect.
I love that you brought up his huge point about ambiguity. I think this is something that we easily forget because we have been reading, writing, and speaking for years now, and those things have become second nature. I also like the idea of a familiolect. I could see that being a cool exercise to do in a classroom: have students write down words that their family uses to refer to something, or someone that are not typically used.
I really like how you connected your first point to your own personal experience. I can't imagine a book being published that is not using to children. I don't know why a book that would hurt a students grammar be published. And lastly, I definitely see students making predictions of words if they do not know the word.
you have some really good points about this chapter! I love how you used personal connections to relate to what the book was explaining. This will help a lot in your own classroom. I like your point that sight word books can cause more improper grammar.
At first when I started reading it, it was hard for me because my background English is not that good. I spent so much time on reading for this chapter. It starts with the how I understand what the chapter is about how written text works and the description of it makes me understand more before I read into the details. The language levels was interesting because the way how it describes chart but for me in my future class. I would not use this chapter to teach because it would be hard for preschool kids. But I believe I could use some strategies from this chapter. What I have learned from this chapter is basically about how texts are constructed not only make them comprehensible but actually teach us to read by them.
I think you could really simplify and introduce some of the things learned in the chapter for preschool children. I'm glad you still care and read about these things even though it will not particularly help with the preschool children. Keep it up!
It is interesting how you had to use your understanding of English to read about understanding English. I bet is was very difficult understanding the chapter because even for me there were a few things in the chapter I quite didn't understand. What are some strategies you would use from this chapter?
There was A LOT of information in this chapter and a good part of it was new to me. Or I had already learned it before, but forgot about it. The first thing I came across that would help me as a teacher is Phonics. Phonics is a huge thing when learning the English language. Goodman defines Phonics as, "the set of relationships between the orthography and a specific speaker's phonology." As a teacher you really need to model and maybe correct how a word is pronounced. The second thing I came across is homophones/homographs. These can be so confusing to students. They think they have a word down and then they're told thats the wrong way of saying it. It doesn't make sense to them yet. Take this slow and really get them to understand and see the patterns. Thirdly, reading and comprehending something you are reading is formed by you. There are three kinds of meanings we talk from a reading. Experiential meaning which is made by our experiences, interpersonal meaning which is made by our feelings and attitudes, and lastly textual meaning which is made by the structure of the text and want strategies you use to build meaning.
I agree that when it comes to homophones/homographs that it is important to take it slow and make sure the students are understanding them and the patterns. What is a lesson you could use to teach homophones/homographs?
There were a lot of things in chapter 6 of Goodman that were helpful to me as a future teacher. I think the biggest one was Phonics!! Phonics is going to be essential in teaching students. As a teacher I will need to model phonics and be able to pronounce words correctly for students. Also Goodman discusses the use of frequent words and being able to teach the students frequent words and repeat them to assure they are being learned. On page 80 there is a chart of the most frequent words in three different texts. The frequency of the words demonstrates if they are common in the English vocabulary. A third thing I found important in Chapter 6 is the meaning of a text. The meaning is constructed by the reader and their interaction with the text. The three types of meaning are experiential meaning, interpersonal meaning, and textual meaning. Sometimes a person meaning of a story is different than the authors intentional meaning. As a teacher I will need to understand the meaning of the story but also understand the students meaning.
I was actually kind of confused by this chapter because it was talking about a lot of terms that I didn't know, but there was a lot of interesting information about language. One thing I thought was interesting was that understanding language depends on so many factors, not just the fact that you are able to read it or hear it. I think this is important to remember when teaching kids because they can all be at such different levels. Another thing I found interesting was the stress in the chapter on ambiguity of language. Since almost everything in the English language is open to more than one interpretation, it's amazing that kids are even able to learn it. He gave examples of how people make sense of text as well: by using schemas, perceiving things differently in different contexts, and using alternate information sources or going on minimal information. I think it's important to know how we work through text so you know what the kids might be going through when trying to understand it. The See Spot Run example was pretty cool because almost everyone has read that. It surprised me to be told that it has grammar problems that are confusing to kids. Once he explained it though, it totally made sense how it would be confusing. I also thought the list of words that are the most common in stories was cool to see. I think that list could be used as a vocabulary list to make sure kids know before reading. That way they would at least be prepared with knowledge of the most common words and then be able to move on to the more difficult vocabulary or use their knowledge of these words to help as context clues.
ReplyDeleteI agree with you that this chapter was a bit confusing. There was so much going on and so many aspects of language that I had not even considered. I think so much of the information can be useful to the classroom though. It really broke down the language and patterns within the language. I agree that it was so interesting to learn all of the factors for learning language. I don't remember learn the ambiguity, structure or schemas, but I think the examples in the book (like the See Spot Run example) are very helpful when thinking of what the students are struggling with. I love the idea of a vocabulary list. Have you thought about utilizing a word wall too?
DeleteI really like your idea to make a vocab list of words that commonly appear in stories. The only problem I foresee is children having a hard time understanding words like "and" "the" "it"... words that don't necessarily have a meaning. I think this is when the concept of a word wall comes into play for words that are primarily learned as sight words. I also thought it was really neat that Goodman pointed out the Ambiguity of the English language. I had never considered this before, and all of the examples he gave were very helpful.
DeleteI agree with all of you guys, I had a really hard time with this chapter. I didn't think it flowed from one aspect of language to the other. I also agree that the See Spot Run was a intereseting example because I never noticed any of that.
DeleteTo everyone: I agree the chapter was a difficult read because it was confusing. I think a word wall would have helped me or even a vocabulary list because I had to take so much time out of reading this chapter to look up words.
DeleteThe stress on ambiguity in this chapter is huge! It's not something that as a native English speaker I even realize.The See Spot Run example did show a lot of why there are problems with texts made in that manner.
DeleteYes, I agree with you all about how this chapter was so difficult to understand. Especially, English is my second language, which it takes me sometimes to read. But I think I could use some of the information in this chapter in my future class.
DeleteYou have some very valid points! I agree that English can be very difficult to learn. It is easier for native born Americans! Imagine how much difficult it is to learn English when it is your second language. How would you address a child in your class who is just learning English and is having a hard time understanding the main points of this chapter?
DeleteThere was so much in this chapter! Wow! Starting with the first subsection of written text words systems of language function at different levels within texts. I found it fascinating to identify the similarities and differences between the different types of signs. I think it would be a lot of fun in the classroom to identify the similarities and differences between text in the language. I also found the section on syntactic cue systems to be very informative. There are so many language patterns in English. It can be overwhelming to students and even me to remember them all. I think the pattern ambiguity section shows another great activity in the classroom for the students. The students being able to see and speak the patterns in the classroom. The ambiguity lies within the many words that sound similar but have different spellings and meanings. Overall, I think the general discussion on patterns within the language would help me teach the language to my students to help them grow as a reader. If they are able to identify the patterns, they can easily decipher the similarities and differences in language, syntactic cue systems, pattern ambiguity, and the general patterns within languages. I think that this chapter has so much in it and can really help teachers teach language. It can really help students learn to read and understand the meanings of the readings.
ReplyDeleteThis chapter was very..busy to say the least but interesting in some aspects too. I wonder how hard it is for ELL's to catch on to those language patterns in the english language..
DeleteShannon, I agree that the best term to use for the chapter is busy. I found it interesting overall but it was just to long and I lost interest early on. I wish there was more charts, etc in the chapter to aid me in words I had no prior knowledge on.
DeleteTo both Meredith and Shannon: If you could ask one question to Goodman about this chapter what would it be and why?
There was a lot to this chapter! I love all of your ideas for activities! It sounds like you are ready to teach your kiddos all about language!
DeleteI feel like this chapter is hard for me to understand but I am glad that you said it can really help students learn to read and understand the meanings of the readings.
DeleteOverall I really liked this chapter so to blog about will not be hard. So in order to keep my post semi short I will write down the five this I liked about the chapter and why I liked it (in no particular order).
ReplyDeleteNumber one:the Language Levels and Cue Systems in Oral and Written Language Box found on pg. 65
Reason I liked it: I was unfamiliar with the different language levels in this book and once I started re-reading the chapter this box helped me remember the difference between the levels and cue systems that go with each. I also liked how on pg 66, Goodman asserts the fact that the reason why Phonics is in parentheses is because it is not part of the language level it is a correspondence. I always thought that phonics was a level of language but I guess I was wrong.
Number two: I liked how Goodman used the term familiolect to basically describe a family's way of communication
Reason I like it: The word is fun to pronounce and spell
Number three: Schwa ambiguity and its findings. I never heard of schwa ambiguity before so I liked how Goodman described it as a problematic situation for writers than with readers. This problem occurs more with writers because it is hard to predict which vowel will appear, etc.
What I liked: I referred to some findings above. The findings that Goodman mentions is on pg 71. I completely agree with his findings as well because it stresses that the higher the grade the more the class as a whole (except for some students) will show higher results no matter the experiment.
Number four: On pg 74 Goodman mentions six ways we make sense of texts. I agree with all of them.
Which one do I do more when I read/write: use minimal information to get to meaning. I think I do this more often because I hate when people don't define a word write away.
Number five: See Spot Run!
Reason I like it: I loved reading that book because of the imagery.
While I can come up with five things I liked I felt like this chapter was to long. I lost interest in it once I got to the section "Meaning and pragmatics level". After reading the first paragraph I had a feeling I would learn no new stuff for the rest of the chapter because I already knew that the meaning is in the writer and reader (pg. 85), and well I did.
First of all, I love how you organized your blog response! I wish I had set the format of my response like yours! It is very straight forward and I can see each individual point that can help you become a better teacher very clearly. I agree that Goodman had some really good information in this chapter! It was overwhelming actually how much information was in such a small chapter. I too found myself rereading multiple chapter boxes in order to get a clear understanding of his points. He used some great examples like the See Spot Run you wrote about. The explanations of communication, language, and imagery can all help the teachers and the students. I think his examples are very easy to apply to a classroom because that is how he wrote the chapter. He truly helped me envision myself teaching using his examples and explanations throughout the chapter.
DeleteI don't think I have ever read the book "See Spot Run!", so I actually had a hard time trying to picture the book in my mind. This brings up one of the points Goodman made about the importance of Schema. I think Goodman did an excellent job at describing the way language words in a simple way.
DeleteI also lost interest in this chapter pretty quickly, I actually found the Meanings section the most interesting. Again, Goodman gave fabulous examples of See Spot Run.
DeleteThis was a long chapter! Very overwhelming. I loved See Spot Run as a kid! However, I do have to disagree with you about the word familiolect. It's pretty hard to spell for a word I don't know!
DeleteI did like the way you comment on this chapter and it shows that you got the messages of this chapter. But it's quit hard for me and I did try to read and understand this chapter.
DeleteYour blog post actually helped me to learn things that I may have missed. I liked reading your the most because of the spacing and the organization of your points. Good points and way to not get discouraged when something difficult was thrown at you. Also great way of breaking everything down.
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ReplyDeleteLike my classmates, I loved See Spot Run. It's interesting how kids used the word 'father' as the subject of the sentence and created a miscue that read "Father sees Spot run." I also got to use my background knowledge about the story of "The Man Who Kept House." I read this story already for another one of Dr. Bum's classes! Lastly, I think it's important for parents to realize that babies use their families voices to invent their own sound system. How cool is that?
ReplyDeleteI love all of your examples from the book! I think you were looking towards application in the classroom while reading this chapter which is awesome! I have not hear "The Man Who Kept House." How would you use it in a classroom? What is the nook about?
DeleteI've read See Spot Run but I don't think I've ever read The Man Who Kept House. It sounds familiar.... It's funny looking back now at See Spot Run and catching how the words are used.
DeleteI agree with Meredith, how would you use "The Man Who Kept House" in a classroom and what is it about? Also how would you use "See Spot Run" in a classroom?
DeleteI thought the fact about babies using parent voices was really interesting as well! It just made me think about the fact that we should always read to kids no matter their age because even if they don't understand what you are saying it might be helping them develop their language system.
DeleteI agree with Krista and found that this chapter had lots of vocabulary that I wasn't familiar with. I thought Goodman brought up a great point in talking about Morphophonemic ambigution, the concept that teaching only phonics does not help children because we have so many different ways we use phonics and the rules do not always remain true. So, teaching kids that a certain rule always applies is not effective because they get all sorts of confused when they come across words they do not know. I also thought it was an interesting point that when students read, they learn to read and say the words automatically in their own dialect. This is a huge concept. Missouri isn't quite as southern as other states, but you still come across children in schools saying words with a twang, and it can completely change how they see and pronounce words. I think this also brings up the issue that Dr. Bum sometimes talks about with teaching African American children who speak in Eubonics. Another point I found very interesting was that students learn grammar from imitation. Students learn how to properly construct sentences through the grammar they hear everyday, so it becomes especially important for children to hear correct grammar.
ReplyDeleteI definitely agree with both you and Krista! There was so much I had never hear of before while reading this chapter. It brought up so many great points. Every student is so different when and while they are learning. I found that Goodman really did think about everything and everyone while writing this chapter. How would you ensure that every student hears correct grammar, for example, every day?
DeleteI also agree. It's so important for us to be able to speak proper grammar to these kids. I know I say gonna all the time! It's also good to think about words we may mispronounce as well.
DeleteI have never lived farther south than Arkansas but occasionally I will put an unintentional twang on words.Do you think that teaching grammar through reading books would be more effective?
DeleteI agree with your comment and I think it's hard for to understand all of the words in this chapter. It look me sometimes to understand some information. But anyways, I am glad to learn something new.
DeleteWhen I first read this chapter, I felt like I was in third grade again because there were some really big, confusing words. So needless to say it took me awhile to get through this chapter. What I liked was the first couple paragraphs in the chapter when Goodman compared a written word to a "living entity." We use words to represent so many things like our beliefs or our ideas. Which I think is important in, not just school, but in society. I thought the chart on page 80 was interesting and it makes sense when Goodman says "many words and phrases are used to describe the movement of the main character..." I thought that was interesting because thinking about it, you can't write a sentence without using one of those words. Lastly, I liked the "meanings" Goodman talks about, (experimental, interpersonal, textual and simultaneous). When we think of meanings, its often comprehension. I had a reading comprehension problem when i was in middle school. So I could read the words fluently but I couldn't tell you what the main idea was or what the previous sentence was about. So I think these "meaning" are like making connections.
ReplyDeleteI liked the first couple paragraphs, too! It's amazing how many words we use to express ourselves every day! Imagine all the words we can teach our kiddos!
DeleteThis chapter was kind of overwhelming with so much important information and phrasing that I was unfamiliar with. Comprehension and meaning do go together well. Do you think your comprehension struggles will help you teach readers?
DeleteI like that you were able to connect your own experiences with the ideas that Goodman was talking about. I think describing words as a living entity is great. It helps show the effect word usage has on the meaning of something, and also how frequently they are adapted and change.
DeleteI felt the exact same way! You are not alone! It was hard for me to keep up since there were so many words I have not learned or have forgotten, so I did get discouraged easily. I couldn't skim this chapter like I could the other ones. I had to take it slow and read a lot more to really understand what was being taught.
DeleteI agree the chapter had a lot of words I was unfamiliar with and had to look up. Also I feel that the meanings are like making connections, like the phrase "what is the meaning of..." can be answered when making a connection.
ReplyDeleteThis chapter had so much information! It was really hard to follow. I'm just going to list some of the things that stood out to me, as well as why they stood out.
ReplyDelete1. I thought the part where Goodman was talking about letter and sound ambiguity was incredibly interesting. His mentioning of “familiolect” is incredibly accurate in my own family my Grandma on my Mom’s side was called Baba by all of the grandkids because the oldest couldn’t say grandma. As he got older we continued to call her Baba because that was our word for her.
2. Standardized spelling- this section was also really interesting. When looking at the way kids write it is easy to see how the words get confused. The explanation for how standardized spelling developed (printing press) was also interesting.
3. Last year I worked in a Kindergarten classroom and witnessed a lot of use of the sight word books and Goodman- brought up the fact that these vocabulary focused texts could help lead students to more improperly use grammar. Goodman brings up the fact that readers use a combination of grammar and wording to make sense of a text; making me question the validity of using these books in a classroom.
4. Goodman also brings up that readers and listeners are good at making sense of a text. “As long as we find the text comprehensible we select from the available cues to make predictions and inferences (84).” Because of how ambiguous language is we learn to make predictions even if words aren't used in the manner we expect.
I love that you brought up his huge point about ambiguity. I think this is something that we easily forget because we have been reading, writing, and speaking for years now, and those things have become second nature. I also like the idea of a familiolect. I could see that being a cool exercise to do in a classroom: have students write down words that their family uses to refer to something, or someone that are not typically used.
DeleteI really like how you connected your first point to your own personal experience. I can't imagine a book being published that is not using to children. I don't know why a book that would hurt a students grammar be published. And lastly, I definitely see students making predictions of words if they do not know the word.
Deleteyou have some really good points about this chapter! I love how you used personal connections to relate to what the book was explaining. This will help a lot in your own classroom. I like your point that sight word books can cause more improper grammar.
DeleteAt first when I started reading it, it was hard for me because my background English is not that good. I spent so much time on reading for this chapter. It starts with the how I understand what the chapter is about how written text works and the description of it makes me understand more before I read into the details. The language levels was interesting because the way how it describes chart but for me in my future class. I would not use this chapter to teach because it would be hard for preschool kids. But I believe I could use some strategies from this chapter. What I have learned from this chapter is basically about how texts are constructed not only make them comprehensible but actually teach us to read by them.
ReplyDeleteI think you could really simplify and introduce some of the things learned in the chapter for preschool children. I'm glad you still care and read about these things even though it will not particularly help with the preschool children. Keep it up!
DeleteIt is interesting how you had to use your understanding of English to read about understanding English. I bet is was very difficult understanding the chapter because even for me there were a few things in the chapter I quite didn't understand. What are some strategies you would use from this chapter?
DeleteThere was A LOT of information in this chapter and a good part of it was new to me. Or I had already learned it before, but forgot about it. The first thing I came across that would help me as a teacher is Phonics. Phonics is a huge thing when learning the English language. Goodman defines Phonics as, "the set of relationships between the orthography and a specific speaker's phonology." As a teacher you really need to model and maybe correct how a word is pronounced. The second thing I came across is homophones/homographs. These can be so confusing to students. They think they have a word down and then they're told thats the wrong way of saying it. It doesn't make sense to them yet. Take this slow and really get them to understand and see the patterns. Thirdly, reading and comprehending something you are reading is formed by you. There are three kinds of meanings we talk from a reading. Experiential meaning which is made by our experiences, interpersonal meaning which is made by our feelings and attitudes, and lastly textual meaning which is made by the structure of the text and want strategies you use to build meaning.
ReplyDeleteI agree that when it comes to homophones/homographs that it is important to take it slow and make sure the students are understanding them and the patterns. What is a lesson you could use to teach homophones/homographs?
DeleteThere were a lot of things in chapter 6 of Goodman that were helpful to me as a future teacher. I think the biggest one was Phonics!! Phonics is going to be essential in teaching students. As a teacher I will need to model phonics and be able to pronounce words correctly for students. Also Goodman discusses the use of frequent words and being able to teach the students frequent words and repeat them to assure they are being learned. On page 80 there is a chart of the most frequent words in three different texts. The frequency of the words demonstrates if they are common in the English vocabulary. A third thing I found important in Chapter 6 is the meaning of a text. The meaning is constructed by the reader and their interaction with the text. The three types of meaning are experiential meaning, interpersonal meaning, and textual meaning. Sometimes a person meaning of a story is different than the authors intentional meaning. As a teacher I will need to understand the meaning of the story but also understand the students meaning.
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